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john christopher
12-08-2009, 10:25 AM
Does anyone know of a simple and cost effective software application which will enable me to print from two or more printers of differing formats at the same time, without me having to go through the riggamaroll of manually settings?

The Dark Dude
www.events-horizon.co.uk (http://www.events-horizon.co.uk)

Graham Russell
12-08-2009, 12:30 PM
Event Photo Pro will automatically print different sizes to different printers. No manual "fiddling" is needed. Select the quantity, crop if required and print.

The printers can be either locally attached to the main computer, or attached to remote computers.

Graham

ian griffiths
12-08-2009, 12:31 PM
Expressdigital Darkroom Core, even keeps to your "Dark Dude" theme!

john christopher
12-08-2009, 03:04 PM
Thanks guys! I'm in the process of evaluating differing options as regards viewing and printing applications. These include Photomart's new "Click" system alternative, Graham's "Event Photo Pro" and a software package from down under who for the life of me, I've forgotten the name of. U know Google is a wonderful thing: the name is Chiizu. As for Expressdigital, that game is way too rich for me. BTW: I've nicked named Mike's software "Retina" because ilke my eyes, his software is free. I'm still open to any more suggestions.

The Dark Dude

ian griffiths
12-08-2009, 04:34 PM
John,

Core is only £347.00 at Warehouse Express. http://www.warehouseexpress.com/search/ ... essdigital (http://www.warehouseexpress.com/search/?q=expressdigital)

It is the only fully functional software designed especially for event photographers by event photographers that I am aware of other the the Mac software Triprism I think its called. I dont think PC Event is available any more, this was a package put together by Kodak Professional back in the late 90's but I think it is long gone?

It never ceases to amaze me that photographers will spend thousands on cameras and lenses but bulk at software unless its Photoshop, having said that I read recently that for every purchased copy of PS there are 150 ilegal copies in use! Mines only PS8 but its official!

gary evans
13-08-2009, 11:02 AM
It never ceases to amaze me that photographers will spend thousands on cameras and lenses but bulk at software unless its Photoshop,

Could be that we try and get it right in camera? :D

Seriously though, I buy a camera or lens and it works until it breaks down, whereas with software you dependant on third parties co-operating with each other and hoping that Bill Gates isnt down to his last 30 billion or whatever and changing everything again.

Sorry, a slightly off-topic musing.

gary evans
13-08-2009, 11:04 AM
Sorry, should also have said that Photoshop can do almost anything that many specialist programs do, its just that most people only scratch the surface of its capabilities and so never find out.

ian griffiths
13-08-2009, 12:09 PM
Isn't that the very issue though Gary? Photoshop is very deep and takes ages to learn how to use, it is complicated and its expensive, its more than twice the cost of Darkroom Core.

One of the advantages of Darkroom is how easy it is to use, we sometimes have to bring in people to help out at very short notice and you can teach them how to operate the software to be able to crop, adjust brightness and contrast, add a border and sell/print in less than 5 minutes.

This isn't an indepth knowledge of the program by any means but it is that easy to learn.

Mark Amies
13-08-2009, 12:13 PM
Just picking up on the reference of John's to the kit we have - it is the 'inTouch' - a 4kg touch screen processor with an Event software loaded on-

http://www.photomart.co.uk/ProductDetai ... ctID=37553 (http://www.photomart.co.uk/ProductDetail.asp?ProductID=37553)

gary evans
13-08-2009, 12:19 PM
I see where you are coming from Ian, perhaps that is my advantage that I do not use people with "no prior knowledge" (sic), but only use our own staff for printing/selling and if we do hire in photographers then we go for MPA/BIPP qualified ones who images rarely need cropping.

Our laptops have the hotkeys set so that if an image is dark it is corrected by simply pressing one key, the same for a flat image, a green cast (most common with oustide events) and a blue one (studio) again can all be corrected with one key stroke. We even have preset crops if needs be.



Of course if you will hire in untrained amatuers ................

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

ian griffiths
13-08-2009, 12:40 PM
Thats a cheap shot even for you Gary! :rofl:

Why would you use photographers to sell? We use sales people to sell and photographers to shoot.

Cropping is all part of our sales technique in transferring ownership of the image to the customer, "There we are, how much better is that?" takes 5 seconds boosts sales teriffically.

We also have had to bring peolpe in at short notice at events like the London Mella last year, we were told they were expecting 50,000 people, 110,000 actually turned up on the day, so 5 more sales people with sales stations were brought in on the day.

At the Cheerleading Nationals this year we had 12,500 and you know I was let down badly, so extra people had to be brought in and others reassigned to other duties, had we been using a complicated system it wouldn't have worked. Both these events were in June/July when even with all our teams we were stretched beyond belief, but we got through it and I put much of it down to the ease of use of Darkroom.

ian griffiths
13-08-2009, 12:46 PM
Just as an idea for those who maybe dont know Darkroom, once set up for an event these are the sort of fucntions you use 90% of the day;

Import/rename images:

Put card in card reader, press "i"

Job done.

Find / print images:

f2 = Quick search, enter 4 digit number, enter = Image on screen.

To crop = Page up, navigate using arrow keys. (What you see is what you get)

To print, press 1, 1 for a 7"x 5" or 2, 1 for a 12"x 8" or 3, 1 for a 12" x 8" and two 7"x5"s

Design your own packages and assign a hot key number.

Thats 90% or more of your day!

john christopher
13-08-2009, 02:01 PM
The Big Man is right....

Keeping it simple is 99% of getting it right and if Darkroom Core does exactly that, then I'm man enough to say that I was wrong in not considering it. If I had my way, I'd still be using Breezebrowser (and Picaso). I've sent various e-mails to Chris Breeze the British author of the Breezebrowser suite of applications, about the possibilities of expanding this excellent program into a full Events Photography package but as yet I've not had a word back in reply. Maybe the Dark Dude has pissed him off or something but there you have it. You can't win all of the time.

Tricky Ricky use to drive me crazy talking about "Hotkeys". Now I wished I'd listened instead of making it go through one ear and out the other. Alas, Darkroom Core is not the only application abled to be pimped up via hotkeys.

The Dark Dude
www.events-horizon.co.uk (http://www.events-horizon.co.uk)

Jeremy Nako
13-08-2009, 02:13 PM
Tricky Ricky use to drive me crazy

He drives everyone crazy...

We loves ya anyway Ricky baby....! :rofl:

ian griffiths
13-08-2009, 05:29 PM
John,

Stop messing about and try it!!

You can download a trial version from www.expressdigital.com (http://www.expressdigital.com)

If you need any help call me.

Mark Amies
14-08-2009, 06:07 AM
Photomart used to be a distributor for Express Digital, and as good as it is selling it was a real uphill struggle - and the main reason for this was customer resistance based on the price. Core did sell well, but the one that should have gone to Event guys is Pro, as it had the bells and whistles ( namely the Chromakey element).

So often I would be extolling ED's virtues, and too often I would have people tell me that they didn't need it becuase they could do it with this programme, or that - Picassa and lightroom often being mentioned. Of course Picassa is free and it a programme that System Insight would mention.

I haven't checked recently on the pricing, I hope it has stabilised - I am sure Ian can enlighten. I hope he has better luck than we did! Express digital is something that can only really be succesfully sold when fully demonstrated - so anyone going on Ian's training day ( next weekend Ian?) should ask for a full demo.

ian griffiths
14-08-2009, 08:14 AM
Mark,

I dont need any luck, as I said previously I'm not selling the software, I did that rather sucessfully 10 years ago when it was £4k a copy. What I am trying to do is show those who are serious about event photography a complete workflow system that works at the event and afterwards.

When I heard PM were stocking ED I did say to ED it wouldn't work out, Darkroom is not a product you can allow to telesale, it needs, as you have identified demonstrating, this can be done over the phone with the download trial version but it needs dedicated sales people, not someone just asking if you want to buy it. (Mark, I'm not having a dig at PM.)

Of course you can use all these free/cheap packages but they all have to be learned and thats not easy, running 2, 3 or 4 applications at a time slows your laptop down because of the total resourse demand not to mention potential conflicts between apps.

The big advantage of Darkroom is the ease and speed of use, when you have a line of people waving money, wanting to leave because they left purchasing to the last minute, you dont need software hangs or to be switching from one application to another, this is why the vast majority of us use zoom lenses, yes you will get better results from primes but instead of carrying a 100-400 you'd have to have multiple bodies with 100mm, 135mm, 170mm, 200mm, 300mm and a 400mm and you'll miss shots when changing from body to body, so why hinder yourself with your workflow software? Plus dont forget its 100% tax deductable in the year of purchase, so it is kind of free!

Mark Amies
14-08-2009, 09:11 AM
No problem Ian.

Mark Amies
14-08-2009, 10:06 AM
Actually , with all respect to what you have said Ian, and I am saying this for the benefit of those viewing this- Photomart did actually put a hell of alot of work into the selling and promtion of Express Digital.

We held show days, in which Bryan Osborne, the then UK sales manager for ED was present. We showed/demoed the software at these days. We showed ED to a wide audience at Focus on Imaging 2008, with Keith Trainor doing the demos. I and my colleagues on the sales desk here put a whole load of work talking to people. I know I did, I would spend up to half an hour on the phone with first time enquiries.

With respect to Warehouse Express, I don't see they are doing anything different, and I would be very interested to know what they do with it, and how they handle telephone enquiries.

Photomart did do very well over a two year period, certainly better than any previous UK main distributor - I believe we sold 80 units - which for an high price software was actually pretty impressive.

This may look like a grumble, really it is not, I just want to 'express' my view on the idea that Photomart didn't go beyond a telesales approach. It certainly isn't to challenge you either Ian.

john christopher
14-08-2009, 10:28 AM
Darkroom Core (PC) and Tripism (Mac) have been two event photography specific applications that have been around for ages. The problem was not the product or knowledge of the product but the price of entry (given the alternatives).

I have a press background (18 years covering one hot spot or the other), so when I started in events photography most of my kit was MAC based. That led me directly to three programs, the above mentioned Tripism, (which at the time was almost one & a half K) , Graphic Converter and Image Buddy. Money was tight (it still is) and I simply could not justify the cost of entry to the wonderful world of Tripism given that the alternatives were often less than a third of the cost. Let me be clear about this. If I'd had the money, I would have gone for Trips, it was that good an apps. But I'm not in the habit of spending money that I simply don't have and my cheap alternative of Graphic Converter, Image Buddy and later Photo Mechanic worked well enough for both me and my customers. When I later was forced to go to the dark side, the choice was even clearer. Given what I wanted to do, Darkroom was overkill meanwhile the Breezebrowser suite of applications did everything I wanted (import, view and print) in one sweet hit. All of my sales staff could set it up and use it without needing a degree in physics, leaving me and my photographers to get on taking pictures and making money. I'm afraid to say that this remains as true today as it did then. For most small one man band operations, Darkroom is way over the top. Newer and more cost effective alternatives are coming to market everyday and you would be amiss if you didn't check everything out.

One other thing. Not choosing to use Darkroom doesn't mean that you are less (or more) of a professional than those who do. This used to be said about the "Click" system. I didn't buy it then and I'm not buying it now.